Jump to content
Sign in to follow this  
Eaton Rifles

Rifle balance, it's all one way or the other...

Recommended Posts

Rifle balance is an interesting subject.

Most shooters don't even give it a second thought but it is the difference between a rifle that 'feels' right or not which then translates into downrange performance.

There's no hard and fast rules as much like a trigger it does boil down to personal preference for those that even bother.

I've tried butt heavy, muzzle heavy and totally neutral and I'm a slightly muzzle heavy sort of guy. That is what feels right to me.

 

Unfortunately in order to get this I've had to add 8oz of lead to my stock in order to get the balance point where it needs to be so obviously this then increases the overall rifle weight.

In an ideal world I'd take a drill to the weight in the rear of the stock but that would be sacrilege with the Precise.

I guess I'm just lucky that I have such a light scope....:D

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

See this Holls someone speaking sense no wonder cant hit anything.

 

Most tend to prefer front heavy bias Conors one.

 

Me i want neutral to a tad front light where held for standing. To make that front heavy a tad would require my weights to increase an extra 2Lb. This then creates other problems lugging the thing around in heat but ok lane to lane. MAD GP creased me up 2008 long walk from car to far end and start on standers up the steps, rifle weighed 17Lb plus scope. Took everything right down to the wire throughout grains here and there all add up. Got it down to 12Lb 8 scoped with Armadillo on, think went 13Lb 2 with a genuine Gemini.

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I've tried slightly light on the front and find that I tend to wander especially on standers.

Currently my balance point is half an inch back from my knee point on the hamster and I find that just perfect and a good compromise for standers.

I bet if a lot of FT shooters looked their balance point they'd find they were either too front or rear heavy.

Of course the other thing to consider is having everything top heavy as well which just adds to the problems.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Changed from front to rear.

It should be different for each positon ideally.

 

Having the same balance point doesn't mean the weight is in the same place, it just means on average it is.

Top heavy is the least popular place to put weight.

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
10 minutes ago, robF said:

Changed from front to rear.

It should be different for each positon ideally.

 

Having the same balance point doesn't mean the weight is in the same place, it just means on average it is.

Top heavy is the least popular place to put weight.

 

 

Yea I saw the work in progress on your Walther stock. Fairly drastic cut back to say the least.

Don't you find that the muzzle tends to wander having the weight that far back?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Now you see this where a full sized rifle falls down . why on earth would you want three feet of barrel cylinder stuck out in the breeze ? with the pup you are in the best possible place to put in good scores . wise up and score up men ??? HOLLY

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Posted (edited)
2 hours ago, Eaton Rifles said:

 

Yea I saw the work in progress on your Walther stock. Fairly drastic cut back to say the least.

Don't you find that the muzzle tends to wander having the weight that far back?


Nope. Balance point, mass and intertia aren't the same thing. Welcome to have a go Colin, see what you think. I actually have less movement than before, especially on follow through, even with the Walther.

You can have heavy and light weight and the balance point the same. You can take mass off the front but have mass taken off the back as well and keep it the same. Or you can have a heavy weight right at the front, slow down the muzzle because the mass takes more energy to move, and still lose weight from the front.

That's what bullpups can't do. And the super deep fore-ends, the mess of a trigger linkage and the who cocking under your cheek or not being able to see the end of your scope or be restricted by muzzle over/trigger behind means they're a limited attraction.

Mind you holly must familiar with the concept of not seeing his muzzle because his scope is in the way... :D

 

Edited by robF

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Because it aids keeping on aim a lot better Holls.

Exactly the same if increase butt length sitters are stable at 15"+ but will need more like 14 1/4" standing and 14 3/8" kneeling, its a compromise.

Highering or lowering butt plate from sitters to standers etc creates problems those that do havent figured yet.

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Correct jon. 

 

Moving the butt up and down is something I do less of within a position because of its affect on the cheekpiece relative to the scope and your head. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

At least one persons got it Rob.

Most have angled cheeks in some fashion now if alter the butt pad up or down your neck dont shorten or miraculously grow so contacts higher or lower over that cheek angle introducing pa error diagonally. Times heard it said by top 5 national shooters why have an adjustable butt pad and not alter it between standing, kneeling and sitting must be well over 300 times, there again the type that said its all about standers and kneelers.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I must admit I don't change my butt height between positions though I see plenty that do.

My position behind the scope doesn't seem to change so I don't see there's any point. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
21 hours ago, holly said:

Now you see this where a full sized rifle falls down . why on earth would you want three feet of barrel cylinder stuck out in the breeze ? with the pup you are in the best possible place to put in good scores . wise up and score up men ??? HOLLY

Now you mention it, it does seem odd that not one gp or world championship has been won using one. In fact with all those benefits it seems odd that yhere is only one ( when not in bits) being used in the WHOLE COUNTRY😂😂😭😭😭😭🖕🖕🖕🖕

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Exactly how many quality bull pups have you gents tried ??? HOLLY

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Posted (edited)

Hahahaha DC careful you might put him on the path of righteousness, though I doubt with Holly's build he could shoot a conventional rifle. He should get some tips off Gilly how he manages....:rolleyes:

 

Edited by Eaton Rifles

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I say again , exactly how many quality Bull pups have you shot ??? HOLLY

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
8 minutes ago, holly said:

I say again , exactly how many quality Bull pups have you shot ??? HOLLY

 

I tried your GC many years ago but apart from putting my back out the trigger needed pumping to make it go bang, so does that qualify as quality?  :rofl2:

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

The GC2 pup is not for everybody but my shutz pup was a good one . it got me in the money at the euros  ( £250 )  won a GP in A grade . various other shoots . the new pup should be the one , once it is sorted . i did get the action cheap . so you cannot expect miracles .but one sorted . it will be the best pup i have had ??? HOLOLY

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
3 hours ago, holly said:

I say again , exactly how many quality Bull pups have you shot ??? HOLLY

 

Made a one off in 94/95 action and stock as one, not just some conversion big difference.

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 hour ago, Jon said:

 

Made a one off in 94/95 action and stock as one, not just some conversion big difference.

 

 

Sounds like Holly should have given you some dosh instead of that Gary Cane...:rolleyes:

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I took it to Worcester GP 2006 Jackman and Sir Nick loved it. Carried it around for 4 years and never used before floging for peanuts in 1999. Shame its been severely butchered and ive disowned it.

 

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Jon , then you need to get your -bottom- into gear and make the perfect pup AGAIN ??? HOLLY 

 

PS Pups are the logical conclusion of FT . if you think about it instead of just trotting out what you heard . or some one has told you . try one . you are welcome to try mine . only snag is it could cost you a lot of dosh ??? HOLLY

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Sir Hools i not only made one but it was a ground shaking one off designed as one. Shortly after the Stokey came to club and came out trying to emulate, didnt work. By that not some conventional action modified and a stock to codge in.

Think it was number 6 in stainless hows about 116 shots from a fill of 110bar! You read correct. Cylinder was tested at ISP to 6500psi. One piece trigger 13" long no linkages, blow on blade it could go if set that way and sears returned. Dont have that trouble withh 1 stage triggers any old -rubbish- will do.

 

 

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Pictures Jon . if you could do it then . you can do it now , only better . time to show the world what a real pup can do ??? HOLLY

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Sold it 19 years ago.

 

Did come across it about 12 years back butchered with an aluminium tube line on by you know who and no idea how to set the trigger up being a proper 2 stage jobby had 3/8" creep no joke. Dis honoured though has name on trigger block and date.

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Time to get started on the MK11 Jon ??? HOLLY

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Hate to say it Holly but I think Jon has better things to do with his time....:rolleyes:

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Nonsense ??? HOLLY

 

PS  what could be better than perfection ?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
8 hours ago, holly said:

Time to get started on the MK11 Jon ??? HOLLY

If the moneys there

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I'll have to borrow it off Matt ??? HOLLY

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
10 hours ago, holly said:

I'll have to borrow it off Matt ??? HOLLY

 

Well you had your chance a few years ago. Still reckon your would have been better off getting Jon to sort your Anschutz and get it in the GC stock instead of that stupid Steyr...:rolleyes:

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!

Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.

Sign In Now
Sign in to follow this  

×